Fort Collins Digital Camera Club

You are invited to join us on ZOOM for the "Synthetic Photography SIG". I expect that this will be a controversial SIG as the topic of AI generated art seems to polarize people into 2 camps, they either love the concept that now they can make beautiful art or they hate the idea that "unskilled" people can make better art than they can. I am sure that we will have different views, but I hope that we can get along and respect everyone's views. I want to expand the focus of the Synthetic Photography SIG to include other image editing tools and techniques while maintaining our main focus on AI tools and techniques.

"Freedom of speech is a principle that supports the freedom of an individual or a community to articulate their opinions and ideas without fear of retaliation, censorship, or legal sanction. The right to freedom of expression has been recognised as a human right in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (UDHR) and international human rights law." - Wikipedia

ATTENDEES
Mike Barry
Ken Eis
Jim Fellion
Jim Limburg
Jack Lipscomb
George Theodore
Albert Wang
Chris

1. We looked at a few images created using AI as part of the process. Jim described his efforts to create double pendulum imagery. He created some beautiful images in real life, but the Internet seems to be censoring his attempt to create double pendulum images using AI.

2. We discussed new features in Photoshop 2026 (v27.0.0)
My version of Photoshop was still V26.4.0 and I couldn't make it update. I finally found a link to manually install v27.0.0 and it worked. This update appears to have fixed a problem causing my computer to stall for up to several minutes at random times. I think that the Adobe Updater program has been trying to update Photoshop for months and failing causing the delays.
We also discussed the people selection tool, composition reference in generative fill, generative upscale and harmonize.

3. We diiscussed "What rights does an AI personality have?"

4. Ken and I had a great discussion about what AI can and can't do. Ken and Roger Penrose think that AI capability is more limited than I believe. I would like to expand on this discussion at the next meeting. Ken, please bring more evidence to support your position and I will try to bring more evidence too.

5. We discussed how we were using AI, and how we feel about using AI to create art. Many of the professional photographers at the Photoshop Virtual Summit 2025 appear to have bought into using AI, many of them are giving classes on how to use AI to improve your photography, or at least how to make post processing faster and easier.

6. Let's continue discussing general AI topics next month.

RESOURCES (Where you can find sources of inspiration)

AGENDA FOR OUR NEXT SYNTHETIC PHOTOGRAPHY SIG MEETING - Tue 12/2/2025 @6:00pm
1. Continue discussing "What AI can and can't do".
2. Discuss questions, ethics, techniques, what is happening with AI in general
3. Decide what we want to do at the next meeting

If there is anything related to AI that you would like to discuss at our SIG meeting, please email me so I can add them to our agenda.

Please email Mike, info@fcdcc.com, when you find mistakes, missing information or if you have suggestions for the Synthetic Photography SIG and I will try to address the issues.

--------------------------- results from ZOOM -----------------------

Meeting summary

Quick recap
The group discussed Jim Limburg's experiences with creating images using both AI and physical pendulum techniques, including technical challenges and results. They explored various AI features in photography software like Photoshop and Lightroom, while examining the ethical implications of using AI to create or alter images. The conversation concluded with discussions about the evolving relationship between traditional photography and AI-driven image generation, including legal implications and societal benefits of AI technology.

Next steps
Jim Limburg: Send meeting summary to Mike as a screenshot/image instead of text to avoid email blocking issues
Mike: Update Adobe Creative Cloud to version 27.0
Ken: Provide Roger Penrose book reference/information about consciousness and sentience not being computational

Summary

Blackburn Pendulum Project Challenges
Jim Limburg shared his experience trying to create images using AI, mentioning that his computer crashed twice and he encountered error messages on Firefly for violating policies, likely due to the term "Blackburn Pendulum." Albert showed a photo of a dual pendulum setup, which Jim explained was related to the Blackburn Pendulum Project, a technique developed in 1844 and later modified by Wainwright in the 1960s. Jim noted that creating precise images with this technique required building an accurate pendulum system.

Physical Pendulum and AI Image Generation
Jim Limburg discussed his experiments with a physical pendulum to generate symmetric images, which he compared to AI-generated images. He explained the precise ratios and angles needed to achieve certain patterns, and shared some of the results. The group also talked about recent updates to Adobe Photoshop and Lightroom, including new AI-powered features for portrait retouching and dust spot removal. Mike mentioned watching a Photoshop introduction video, highlighting impressive new capabilities like automatic dust spot detection and removal.

AI Tools in Photography Discussion
The group discussed the use of AI tools in photography and image editing, with members sharing their experiences and opinions. They explored various AI features in software like Photoshop, including image upsampling, harmonizing, and content-aware fill. The conversation touched on the ethical implications of using AI to create or alter images, with some members expressing concerns about authenticity and honesty in photography. The group also considered the practical benefits of AI tools for photographers, particularly in streamlining post-processing tasks.

AI and Photography: Blurring Boundaries
The group discussed the evolving relationship between traditional photography and AI-driven image generation. George and Albert explored how AI tools are becoming increasingly sophisticated, blurring the line between AI-generated content and traditional photography, while Mike highlighted concerns about AI's reliance on existing AI-generated images for training. Ken emphasized the unique value of genuine photographs in capturing authentic moments, contrasting with AI-generated images that can be manipulated or generated without actual presence. The conversation touched on the ethical implications of AI's self-referential learning and the potential redefinition of what constitutes a legitimate photograph.

AI Attachments and Sentience Debate
The group discussed the growing phenomenon of people forming emotional attachments to AI chatbots and personalities, with Mike sharing a concerning case of a 14-year-old boy who committed suicide after developing a relationship with an AI companion. The discussion explored philosophical questions about AI sentience and consciousness, with Ken emphasizing that non-sentient AI doesn't have rights, while Chris noted that philosophers have been debating consciousness since ancient times. The conversation concluded with Chris mentioning that while AI cannot currently obtain copyrights or patents in the US and Europe, China is considering allowing AI to hold copyrights for creative work it produces.

AI's Impact and Ethical Considerations
The group discussed the legal and ethical implications of AI, particularly focusing on copyright ownership, sentience, and rights. They explored how AI can benefit society in areas like healthcare, education, and environmental conservation. Ken shared insights from a Nobel Prize-winning physicist about consciousness not being computational, sparking a debate about the capabilities and limitations of AI. The conversation concluded with Mike presenting various ways AI can improve society, from weather prediction to logistics, while acknowledging the need for further discussion on the legal and ethical aspects of AI.

AI can make mistakes. Review for accuracy.